This is it. Everything “just works” on windows. Until that exact same experience is available on Linux it will never take over. And no, I don’t mean “there is an app you can install for a distribution that makes it easy to…”. That is an immediate failure. It needs to be easy to do everything, out of the box, with no additional setup.
I say this as someone that uses windows, Mac, and various flavors of Linux every single day. I want this for Linux, but it isn’t there.
“It works fine if you follow a 10 stage guide filled with terminal commands to configure it properly, which describes commands that are different in your distro.”
Exactly this. I’m comfortable in both windows and Linux. I tried Linux as my daily driver multiple times on my main PC but it was always not worth the effort. I don’t have days of free time anymore to mess with Linux as my main OS. I put Ubuntu on my laptop and while it worked I was often spending days troubleshooting some bug, either with the touchpad not working or with with the disro itself trying to something as simple as an image preview when selecting pictures to upload to discord or whatever.
I’ve spun up dozens of virtual machines on my server at home and that’s where Linux just works. After I get it configured I’ve almost never needed to touch it again. Until Linux gets the basic user experience as easy as windows then people will stay with windows.
Fedora, Arch, Void, and other distros with newer kernels have less issues with new hardware. By not using the latest hardware I mean hardware that’s been out a year or two. Not stuff that’s ancient. You probably won’t have any issues with the latest CPUs and GPUs on say Arch or Fedora, but it can be an issue for things like WiFi cards or on distros like Debian, Linux Mint, and Ubuntu.
How do you not see why that’s a problem? Telling someone to not use new hardware is not a solution, it’s a shitty work around. You’re just proving my point that Linux is not ready for main stream use. Unless all you do is read email and Facebook then sure Linux will work but for people actually trying to enjoy their PC, it’s bad. You people are actually delusional.
Also you seem to have lost track: new hardware is only really a problem with distros like Debian and Ubuntu. Even then you can make it work by adding a newer kernel - I actually did this to run Ubuntu on a brand new machine.
CPU and GPU companies put a lot of effort to make their latest stuff work with Linux, but that only holds true on recent kernels. Intel WiFi will also work fine, again on newer kernels. The issue is companies like Broadcom, and distros with old kernels.
You still are missing the point and I doubt you’ll get it. To the average user they don’t give a fuck why it doesn’t work. It doesn’t work. And until it does then the average user isn’t going to jump through hoops to make their hardware work.
Yeah that’s actually a valid point. More distros should use newer kernels for hardware support reasons, to improve the OOB experience.
It wasn’t what you said before though was it? I don’t think that was me not getting the point so much as you changing what you said.
Installing drivers on Windows used to be quite common, still is common for some devices, and it’s actually often easier to install drivers on Linux than it is on Windows. So I don’t think it’s too unreasonable to make people install drivers or kernel using an included utility.
This is it. Everything “just works” on windows. Until that exact same experience is available on Linux it will never take over. And no, I don’t mean “there is an app you can install for a distribution that makes it easy to…”. That is an immediate failure. It needs to be easy to do everything, out of the box, with no additional setup.
I say this as someone that uses windows, Mac, and various flavors of Linux every single day. I want this for Linux, but it isn’t there.
“It works fine if you follow a 10 stage guide filled with terminal commands to configure it properly, which describes commands that are different in your distro.”
Cool.
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Exactly this. I’m comfortable in both windows and Linux. I tried Linux as my daily driver multiple times on my main PC but it was always not worth the effort. I don’t have days of free time anymore to mess with Linux as my main OS. I put Ubuntu on my laptop and while it worked I was often spending days troubleshooting some bug, either with the touchpad not working or with with the disro itself trying to something as simple as an image preview when selecting pictures to upload to discord or whatever.
I’ve spun up dozens of virtual machines on my server at home and that’s where Linux just works. After I get it configured I’ve almost never needed to touch it again. Until Linux gets the basic user experience as easy as windows then people will stay with windows.
Well yeah Ubuntu is shit. I haven’t had nearly this many problems. I also don’t use the latest hardware which helps immensely.
It’s not just Ubuntu. “Just don’t use modern hardware” is not a solution.
Fedora, Arch, Void, and other distros with newer kernels have less issues with new hardware. By not using the latest hardware I mean hardware that’s been out a year or two. Not stuff that’s ancient. You probably won’t have any issues with the latest CPUs and GPUs on say Arch or Fedora, but it can be an issue for things like WiFi cards or on distros like Debian, Linux Mint, and Ubuntu.
How do you not see why that’s a problem? Telling someone to not use new hardware is not a solution, it’s a shitty work around. You’re just proving my point that Linux is not ready for main stream use. Unless all you do is read email and Facebook then sure Linux will work but for people actually trying to enjoy their PC, it’s bad. You people are actually delusional.
I do a lot more than browse email.
Also you seem to have lost track: new hardware is only really a problem with distros like Debian and Ubuntu. Even then you can make it work by adding a newer kernel - I actually did this to run Ubuntu on a brand new machine.
CPU and GPU companies put a lot of effort to make their latest stuff work with Linux, but that only holds true on recent kernels. Intel WiFi will also work fine, again on newer kernels. The issue is companies like Broadcom, and distros with old kernels.
You still are missing the point and I doubt you’ll get it. To the average user they don’t give a fuck why it doesn’t work. It doesn’t work. And until it does then the average user isn’t going to jump through hoops to make their hardware work.
Yeah that’s actually a valid point. More distros should use newer kernels for hardware support reasons, to improve the OOB experience.
It wasn’t what you said before though was it? I don’t think that was me not getting the point so much as you changing what you said.
Installing drivers on Windows used to be quite common, still is common for some devices, and it’s actually often easier to install drivers on Linux than it is on Windows. So I don’t think it’s too unreasonable to make people install drivers or kernel using an included utility.